Curse

Wish Swiftdeath · May 12, 2009, 12:21 PM // 12:21

Try playing pure healer without prot/damage mitigation in Hard Mode

Good luck sir

Picuso · May 12, 2009, 03:05 PM // 15:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wish Swiftdeath

Try playing pure healer without prot/damage mitigation in Hard Mode

Sadly, too many monks use pure healer HB bar... They success after some (sometimes, a lot of) party wipes, but they think that their bar > every other bar.

That's why H/H exist xD

Daian Namgnik · May 14, 2009, 02:38 AM // 02:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xenomortis

Someone simply wanding through the game can finish it with a high success rate if they're in a suitable group.

I disagree. Especially in HM. However, I thought finishing the game was the purpose of the game and groups was the topic of the thread. Sorry if I misunderstood.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wish Swiftdeath

Try playing pure healer without prot/damage mitigation in Hard Mode

Good luck sir

That's about all I do. Most of the time, no problem. Some of the time "good luck" is helpful, however.

Of course, I'm not one of these guys who joins just any group. My time is valuable and my windows of opportunity to play are small. If it doesn't feel right, I bounce. If a quick and decent PUG cannot be found, I go with H/H and can finish the vast majority of the quests and missions that way, most in HM.

Admittedly, I don't do much of the UW and FoW stuff....when I do, I alter my bar according to the needs of party, but then feel as if am not as effective due to not being on auto pilot and thus less effective.

But hey, different stokes for different folks.

Wish Swiftdeath · May 14, 2009, 04:42 AM // 04:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daian Namgnik

I disagree. Especially in HM. However, I thought finishing the game was the purpose of the game and groups was the topic of the thread. Sorry if I misunderstood.

That's about all I do. Most of the time, no problem. Some of the time "good luck" is helpful, however.

Of course, I'm not one of these guys who joins just any group. My time is valuable and my windows of opportunity to play are small. If it doesn't feel right, I bounce. If a quick and decent PUG cannot be found, I go with H/H and can finish the vast majority of the quests and missions that way, most in HM.

Admittedly, I don't do much of the UW and FoW stuff....when I do, I alter my bar according to the needs of party, but then feel as if am not as effective due to not being on auto pilot and thus less effective.

But hey, different stokes for different folks.

Pure heal as in no prot spirit or imbagon. Good luck in charr lands

afya · May 14, 2009, 08:32 PM // 20:32

I run WoH hybrid most of the time and ppl seem ok with it.

I think PUG is just so bad that many monks simply cant go prot. Red bar up is the best they can do.

From recent PUG of zquest:
1) 80% of the monks bring breeze, they probably think thats some kind of protection!?

2) more than 2 direct heals

3) several 10e skill (heal party, heal other, breeze!?)without e-management

4) even no elite, wtf

JoeKnowMo · May 14, 2009, 08:53 PM // 20:53

Was in a pug for Eldritch Ettin, with 3 HB monks (1 person and their 2 heroes) and people kept dying. If my necro didn't have Reckless Haste and Enfeebling Blood, we'd have had a lot more deaths.

And people like to run either all heals on an HB or all prots. Hybrid is a foreign concept.

JDRyder · May 14, 2009, 09:32 PM // 21:32

Well if you want a answer you have to look at it from the teams point of view. The Woh builds are harder to use "I find the HB builds harder but w/e" for most people because they don't understand what the skill curve is. I find every monk that keeps at it sooner or later will find that WoH > HB. They can cry out "HB is better! It heals for more and its faster!" all they want but at the end of the day his group died and in my group no one got below half HP.

Any noob can hit 1-6 to heal a target to full. I've seen a lot of monks try to use WoH builds and just fail. They use all their energy don't prot until the team member is dead and are to busy with sucking at the game to think about what skills they are using. I think because HB is so easy for anyone theres less chance "from the non-monk point of view" of getting that noob who does not understand why prots save energy and why they make the team stable.

So for the other 6members of the group in their point of view they feel safer knowing that the monk is using a build that anyone could use. This is why pugs demand HB. Who knows, everyone in that group could be uber players that when they do X Pve with their guild they use WoH monk(s) but they are pugging this, you are in the pug group, you are a pug. However a lot of people are just closed minded and think HB is the only way.

Imo just do what I always do, use WoH or whatever else you like using, if they as for HB say no, if they kick you out the group your better off anyway. If they keep you and you do awesome you've opened a few minds up that HP is not the only build

glacialphoenix · May 15, 2009, 03:25 AM // 03:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by JDRyder

The Woh builds are harder to use "I find the HB builds harder but w/e"

I find the HB builds harder to manage energy with. =\ Can't prot in time, if the party's mostly idiots I have to spam... Frankly, if I wanted a party heal, I'd take LoD. Or even better, I'd take a Rt with Kaolai, thank you.

EDIT: And after I say that... oh well. *trundles off to get a restoration 40/40.

Quote:

2) more than 2 direct heals

So, does Patient Spirit count as a direct heal?

Wish Swiftdeath · May 15, 2009, 07:20 AM // 07:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wish Swiftdeath

Given that WoH is likely to be nerfed there's a good chance HB will be used even more.

ohhai1234567

JDRyder · May 15, 2009, 06:07 PM // 18:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by glacialphoenix

I find the HB builds harder to manage energy with. =\ Can't prot in time, if the party's mostly idiots I have to spam... Frankly, if I wanted a party heal, I'd take LoD. Or even better, I'd take a Rt with Kaolai, thank you.

EDIT: And after I say that... oh well. *trundles off to get a restoration 40/40.

Yea I agree on that but as I said anyone can use a HB build. Not everyone knows how to prot, so some people have worse energy management with WoH builds.

Also I find myself not using Woh that much anymore because its so boring to me now D: I use LoD as well as boon prot a lot now.

Xenomortis · May 15, 2009, 06:16 PM // 18:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by glacialphoenix

So, does Patient Spirit count as a direct heal?

Well it certainly doesn't count as a prot.

glacialphoenix · May 15, 2009, 08:06 PM // 20:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xenomortis

Well it certainly doesn't count as a prot.

Nope, it isn't, but if you time it off right... it's not a straight 'i whack the button, you get pretty blue numbers immediately' skill, either.

toocooltang · May 15, 2009, 08:24 PM // 20:24

The monks protection line is much more useful than the healing line. If I need a monk I almost always bring them as full prot or hex/condition removal. Sometimes I'll bring them as RoJ. For healing I prefer the Rits because they can go chan/resto and use splinter to buff physical dmg.

Jaigoda · May 16, 2009, 03:16 AM // 03:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by toocooltang

The monks protection line is much more useful than the healing line. If I need a monk I almost always bring them as full prot or hex/condition removal. Sometimes I'll bring them as RoJ. For healing I prefer the Rits because they can go chan/resto and use splinter to buff physical dmg.

Do Rits have WoH and Divine Favor? No? Thought not.

While prot is obviously awesome and such, heal is still superior to any other means of red-bar-up. And no one right now can completely prevent all damage, so you have to have healing in there somewhere, and WoH/Patient does that better than anything.

glacialphoenix · May 16, 2009, 10:04 AM // 10:04

Quote:

If I need a monk I almost always bring them as full prot

Unless you manual them, hero monks suck at prot, though.

Quote:

Do Rits have WoH and Divine Favor? No? Thought not.

To be fair, Rits have Spirit Transfer.

That being said, I tend to dislike splitting bars into one prot one heal: i'd rather see two hybrids that can support each other. Not saying it doesn't work, just that "Oh shit our prot died, now we have no prots at all" is not a scenario I want to face.

Wish Swiftdeath · May 16, 2009, 03:32 PM // 15:32

Tried running HB today, was horrible.

Was forced to sit there watching people take damage knowing if i had guardian or SoA it could have easily been negated.

Yes it works, but it still sucks.

glacialphoenix · May 16, 2009, 05:02 PM // 17:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wish Swiftdeath

Tried running HB today, was horrible.

Was forced to sit there watching people take damage knowing if i had guardian or SoA it could have easily been negated.

Why'd you run it anyway?

I have that same issue with HB - not enough space to fit the prots I want in.

bhavv · May 16, 2009, 11:26 PM // 23:26

My favorite monk bars to use together:

Patient Spirit, Dwaynas Kiss, WoH, Prot Spirit, Signet of Rejuvenation, Cure Hex, and two optional slots.

Reversal of Fortune, Gift of Health, Life Sheath, Spirit Bond, Shielding Hands, Shield of absorption, two optional slots.

The optional slots can be more hex removal, or whatever energy management you prefer. I like to place two Aegis on my ellys or necros, also convert hexes or extinguish can also be used on the casters as well if required, so its usually better for those two monks to add two energy management skills - Power Drain and Leech Signet for heroes

.

Usually will also have a third heal rit or paragon depending on the full team build, but those two monk bars are universal and can be used in just about any part of the game.

I might even try a third smiters boon RoJ hero once I get my second account through all of the campaigns and get to use 6 heroes.

legacyofkain85 · May 17, 2009, 01:14 AM // 01:14

for general play ,a hybrid monk bar will always be better,people tend to ask hb builds imo in gimmick builds,farming some elite areas for example urgoz warren where a monk uses hb to ¨spam¨ heal party while powered by the bip necro.Heroes have some good protection Ai now tbh,but not in the fact that they know how to use them but in the fact that they spam them on everyone pretty much,i get prot spirit on me before the first mob even hits me.The downside to this is that they burn their energy fast,so when i want prots i either use a necro or an ele with [ether renewal].Whenever i want to use a healer hero, it ends up being a woh healer.
I don't see how a hb monk will be superior to a hybrid heal/prot monk in general play.

Eliza Deathblade · May 17, 2009, 01:24 AM // 01:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by legacyofkain85

for general play ,a hybrid monk bar will always be better,people tend to ask hb builds imo in gimmick builds,farming some elite areas for example urgoz warren where a monk uses hb to ¨spam¨ heal party while powered by the bip necro.Heroes have some good protection Ai now tbh,but not in the fact that they know how to use them but in the fact that they spam them on everyone preety much,i get prot spirit on me before the first mob even hits me.The downside to this is that they burn their energy fast,so when i want prots i either use a necro or an ele with [ether renewal],and leave my monk hero whenever i use one as a woh healer.
I don't see how a hb monk will be superior to a hybrid heal/prot monk in general play.

They use a party wide heal thats pretty good for a tank and spank team build, but for a general team build with no specified tanks then yea a heal/prot hybird would be WAY better